The sky is falling!

Supertiger

New member
Doc,
Yes I do own hunting guns. The firearms are kept at all time locked, out of reach of children. I'm sure it is the same for most of you, accident can happen so fast.

I don't think you will loose your gun rights but it may be more control on ownership and acquisition.
We are always talking about rights. What's about duty?

Are you really serious about riots? Some have said the same about Obama as President.
You are the most influent country in the world. From my point of view, it was more negatively those last recent years. But your nation has the worse and the best. Maybe this why so many people are fascinated and puzzled at same time.

With respect,
,
 

Supertiger

New member
I know what the Webster definition is but I was wondering what yours was.

West country would have been more appropriate. Uncivilized is something easier. Talibans are uncivilized...
I know what the Webster definition is but I was wondering what yours was. That's usually an interesting question to have answered but perhaps too broad in scope for here. I had a friend who once described the USA as the, "Most technically advanced, uncivilized country in the world". We were discussing the differences in the US and British laws and attitudes to firearms at the time.

By the way, your English is a lot, lot better than my French .... or Spanish.
 

rj's barn

Member
bans.... not good

I hate to compare us to britain. But its the best example i can think of. The only difference between us and them is they dont have a bill of rights that can be trampled and ignored by the empowered elite.
First, in the early 1900s they banned full auto machine guns for the civilian market
Later they regulated handguns stating that civilians had little legitimate use for a handgun
Later they banned handguns outright.
Somewhere around the 50's they regulated shotguns and rifles, stating that civilians had little legitimate us for a shotgun or rifle.
1960-70-ish they banned rifles and shotguns outright
recently they banned knives, pepper spray, blowguns, sword canes, long needles, utility knives....... any object that could be used as an "offensive weapon" even if the "weapon" is used offensively in self defense or if you use said object in your vocation.
Each time a regulating action was taken, crime stats rose a little further. Until today, where per capita civilian victimization is roughly twice as high in all areas as they are in the United States where we can still act in our own defense under certain perfect circumstances; like you can stab a guy with a parring knife if he comes after you with a gun.

Just thought id let yall know where we are headed as "citizens of the world"
under our fearless socialist rulers.
 

EastTexFrank

Senior Member
Gold Site Supporter
Somewhere around the 50's they regulated shotguns and rifles, stating that civilians had little legitimate us for a shotgun or rifle.
1960-70-ish they banned rifles and shotguns outright

Well, I know that's not right or it wasn't when I left there in '85 but my information is 20 years out of date. Perhaps Mith can give us an update.

What I will say is that all firearms had to be licensed and the amount of ammo was strictly controlled. If you were a registered firearm owner, you basically surrendered all your civil rights. For example, the police had automatic right of entry in to your home at any time of the night or day without a warrant and if your firearm was not secured in a safe, they could confiscate it and arrest you. There were lots of other rules and regulations that basically stripped you of your rights under the law but one right you did have back then was to own a shotgun. Yes, it did have to be licensed and registered but there was no way that the police could stop you from getting one. It WAS possible to own pistols and rifles back them too but it was a PITB. You had to make your application to the courts, have your home, your gun safe and security system inspected by the police, appear in front of a judge to explain why you wanted those firearms, etc., etc. If the police objected to the granting of a license in court then it was all over. Bye bye hope of ever getting guns.

A couple of lunatic shootings brought about even stricter laws and restrictions after I left to where it is impossible to own a handgun and access to rifles is almost impossible. What makes this all the more strange is that there are probably more illegal guns on the streets of the UK, in criminal hands, than there ever were. Figure it out.
 

rj's barn

Member
The information i got was from the internet and my wife used it to write a research paper. I could be backassward wrong being that I didnt get it directly from the British law books. I read an article recently where a man was jailed for 2 weeks for carrying knives he used in his profession as a printer because they could be used for "offensive purposes". Scared the hell out of me because I can see us going that far too.
 

EastTexFrank

Senior Member
Gold Site Supporter
The information i got was from the internet and my wife used it to write a research paper. I could be backassward wrong being that I didnt get it directly from the British law books. I read an article recently where a man was jailed for 2 weeks for carrying knives he used in his profession as a printer because they could be used for "offensive purposes". Scared the hell out of me because I can see us going that far too.

Same thing happened to a chef who was arrested because he had his kitchen knives rolled up in a bundle and was carrying then under his arm as he walked down the street.

Over the last several years the British police have become much more like American police in that they are reactive rather than proactive. It used to be that there were beat cops walking around the streets all the time and many of them spent the majority of their careers patrolling the same beat. They knew everybody and everything that was going on in the neighborhood. It was as if they were responsible for crime in their little area and they took care of it. It might entail clipping some kid on the ear for stealing apples from a neighbor's tree (that was me) and dragging him home to his parents or making sure that the local drunk got home safely from the pub on a Saturday night.

Times have changed and they have swung so far in the other direction that it scares me at times. It almost seems that they have developed an "us and them" mentality where the police force stands on it's own for law and order and the general public, if they're not all criminals, are at least all potential criminals. Let's just say that they no longer "Serve and Protect", at least not the public.
 

Doc

Admin
Staff member
Gold Site Supporter
Doc,
Yes I do own hunting guns. The firearms are kept at all time locked, out of reach of children. I'm sure it is the same for most of you, accident can happen so fast.

I don't think you will loose your gun rights but it may be more control on ownership and acquisition.
We are always talking about rights. What's about duty?


What about duty? Not sure where you are going with that thought.

Are you really serious about riots? Some have said the same about Obama as President.

,

Yes, I am serious. First off, as I said I do not think the government will take away our right to own arms. If they did I am sure there would be repercussions one of which very well might be riots. I hope and pray we never see that day but I understand for every action there is a reaction. I only wish the folks in Washington would think before they do some of the lame brain things that they do. :pat:
 

urednecku

Member
Doc,
Yes I do own hunting guns. The firearms are kept at all time locked, out of reach of children. I'm sure it is the same for most of you, accident can happen so fast.

I don't think you will loose your gun rights but it may be more control on ownership and acquisition.
We are always talking about rights. What's about duty?

Are you really serious about riots? Some have said the same about Obama as President.
You are the most influent country in the world. From my point of view, it was more negatively those last recent years. But your nation has the worse and the best. Maybe this why so many people are fascinated and puzzled at same time.

With respect,
,
Yes, most ARE kept out of reach of children, but still, we can have instant access, for defense of our home if need be. Also, the kids learn early about guns, and what they can/will do, so it takes the mystery out of them so they are not so likely to play with one they find. I have used the NRA's "EDDY EAGLE" program with my kids, which teaches "if you find a gun...STOP, DON'T TOUCH, LEAVE THE AREA, TELL AN ADULT".


As for DUTY, I feel it is MY DUTY, as a father and husband, to protect my family to the best of my ability. And I feel it would be much easier, not to mention more successful, to defend them from a couple of bad guys breaking my door down with a .12 guage pump, or a .45, than with a steak knife or just asking them to leave.
Where I live, if you are able to dial 9-1-1, it might take 15 minutes for the cops to get here.

And like probably like 99.9999% of gun owners, I believe the founding fathers of this country believed that strongly enough for it to be only the second amendment, of several, intending it to stand for as long as this country stands, and helping to make sure the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA stands much longer that it otherwise could.
 

PBinWA

Member
In Canada it is your duty to let the Police protect you. You are not allowed to protect yourself from harm with a firearm (or any "weapon"). Just as your freedom of speech is also not protected.

There are some big fundamental differences between the two countries. Canada is ruled by a few large densely populated cities that set the rules and policies for what is otherwise a huge sparsely populated land mass.

There are many Canadians such as myself that do not agree with Canada's gun rules. Unfortunately, the Canadian parliamentary system is slanted and gives too much representation to certain provinces and cities.
 

PBinWA

Member
As I put on my moderator's hat, should this discussion be moved to ForumsForums? It is bit too polarizing for NetTractorTalk?
 

EastTexFrank

Senior Member
Gold Site Supporter
I don't think that it's nearly as contentious as some of the discussions we've had on FF. In fact it's been positively polite for the most part. I also don't think that it's going anywhere and will die a natural death soon ... but it's been kind of interesting.

Feel free to make an executive decision. I don't mind one way or the other.
 

Doc

Admin
Staff member
Gold Site Supporter
I"ve been watching for just that PB. So far like ETF said it has been rather polite. As long as we can discuss and not debate I don't mind it here.
If anyone prefers more of a debate type of thread feel free to head over to www.forumsforums.com/3_9/ and start up a thread on any subject you choose.

Thanks to all posters in this thread for keeping it polite and very civil. :thumb: Good job!!!! :D
 

Erik

Member
actually, PB, I'm kind of surprised it hasn't been moved into the "politics" section of NTT - but that's the only move I would consider a reasonable precaution from my side of the issue.
Like Doc & ETF, it's a charged topic, but is staying polite so far.
I highly suspect moving the thread to FF would derail it badly.
 
B

bczoom

Guest
Like Doc & ETF, it's a charged topic, but is staying polite so far.
I highly suspect moving the thread to FF would derail it badly.
I expect if I joined the thread, it wouldn't be polite and would derail. :hide:

SuperTiger - What do you clean or put on your lap when some boy comes to pick up your daughter for a date? The bigger it is, the more intimidated the boy will be (and make sure he's nice to your daughter).
 

joe lasky

Member
As I put on my moderator's hat, should this discussion be moved to ForumsForums? It is bit too polarizing for NetTractorTalk?

Oh the irony :D

I expect if I joined the thread, it wouldn't be polite and would derail.

Funny Brian, I've never noticed you to be anything but polite. I mean that with all sincereity.

I would guess that most people here owning firearms in the U.S have never been convicted of a crime nor have ever had to actually use their weapon in self defense. Yes, the U.S does have it's shares of issues, particularly when you have such a "free" society as ours, but probably no more or no less issues than any other country. You walk a fine line between the goverment running the people, and the people running the goverment. Overall, for all the bad newsmedia the U.S gets, our country still has the people running the goverment (for the most part), which is the way it should be.
 
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urednecku

Member
Moving back toward the original subject of this thread.....
I also have found the WallyWorld's around here to be very low on ammo the last several times I was there. Especially the hand-gun calibers.......
And yes, the prices on the (empty) shelves seem to be higher, too.
 

EastTexFrank

Senior Member
Gold Site Supporter
Moving back toward the original subject of this thread.....
I also have found the WallyWorld's around here to be very low on ammo the last several times I was there. Especially the hand-gun calibers.......
And yes, the prices on the (empty) shelves seem to be higher, too.

You're right. I was there yesterday looking for .40 S&W and .357 mag and they didn't have any .... none at all, and they didn't know when they would be getting any. The pistol ammo shelf had 5 boxes on it, 3 stacked on top of one another presumably all one caliber and then one single box and another single box. That was it. I didn't even ask what those 3 calibers were but you can bet it was something relatively obscure.

Their rifle ammo selection wasn't any better but they did have shot shells although it all seemed to #7's and #8's. I didn't see any buck or slugs. What the heck is going on???? I can kind of understand why some people might be hoarding .223's, 7.62x39's, etc, etc., but who can be stocking up on .380's for heaven's sake.

On a personal note, I just got a .40 S&W pistol and had to order ammo on the net because I couldn't find any within a 30 mile radius of where I live. It should arrive next week but until then, all I have is a very expensive "club" to beat some intruder with. That's not quite true but that's my story, :wink:
 
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