YM186D - Should I buy it?

California

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I've located a 186D (US version YM1510D) that looks near as rough as my YM240. The seller says it leaks at the input to the front axle and at the pto lever (I'm not sure that one is easily fixed) so it's clearly well used. It's priced less than half of what I see pristine examples advertised for. I'm debating whether to make the all-day drive to go look at it.

From what I've been reading, people use these little things for a 5 ft tiller and 4 ft rotary mower. Probably slowly! My main use would be close-quarters mowing.

I could use a tractor tiny enough to get under my apple trees. Those are 9.5 -16 rear tires. And I sure could use the shuttle shift.

Does anyone have experience with these?

And a related question: is it reasonable to bring this home on a 4x8 utility/snowmobile trailer? Assuming the tractor's tires are loaded, it's right at the 1600 lb cargo capacity of the trailer. I'm a little gun-shy after I towed home the YM240; that was 5000 total lbs towed behind a Trooper rated to tow 2,000 lbs. I didn't have any problems (and kept far from other cars!) but after that I swore never again. This time would be 2k for 300 miles behind my Subaru (also rated to tow 2k, but it's pretty small).

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Doc

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Guess the question is how much it leaks. Lots of the older equipment will leak a little. It looks like a neat little tractor. And you sure have the use for it, so I say heck yeah you ought to buy it.
I'd prefer a little bigger trailer than 4x8 but as long as you tie it down good you should be fine since you would not be over the towing limit of the vehicle. (well maybe a little bit over if the trailer weight 500 lbs but that would be okay in my book.)
 

Mark777

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Hey California,

Is it a three or four digit hour meter? How many hours on the rig??

"The seller says it leaks at the input to the front axle and at the pto lever"

Not quite sure what he means with 'input to front axle'? Never had one leak at the PTO lever either.

Do you recall Whiskey (username)? He re-did his YM187 and that size/model look very nice when they're cleaned up:
 

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California

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Thanks everybody. I'm not seeing anything scary so far.

Mark, here's what he wrote when I asked about condition:
...two small oil leaks one at the three point lever shaft and one at the front drive input shaft front axle.
This unit is $4,000+ cheaper than two other gorgeous ones presently for sale, which is a fair discount for minor repairs. Assuming the tractor is basically sound! I need to get up there and appraise overall condition.

Did some of those have 4 digit meters? I assumed 3-digit, and therefor pointless to ask the hours. I will ask him now. He said he has owned it less than two years.

Also he said it's too small to move snow with the 6 ft rear blade that came with it. Hopefully that is his only reason to get out of it. I can use the blade on my 240 which is better matched to it.

Is there anything in particular I need to look at on that model? The shuttle shift is unfamiliar to me (and very welcome) and I assume the tiny 3-cylinder engine should be smoother and quieter than the big twin I have now. I'm looking forward to prrrr instead of clank-clank-clank.

In my research I read this US-model Yanmar might have a different front axle than its Japanese-market twin, the YM1510D. Maybe beefier for a loader?

It's killing me waiting for an opportunity to take a whole day and go up there! What else should I ask him?

I'll go look for the thread describing the 187.
 

Mark777

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Oh Yeah CA,

Boat load of difference in how smooth the three cylinders are. Quiet, less vibration and smooth. The Power-Shift is everything people say they are too. Shifting on the 'fly' from forward to reverse takes some getting used to....it takes a while to train your fooot not to hit the clutch peddle during the first few sessions :D. The transmission was built specifically for the Japanese rental industry when the tractors are loader fitted.

If I understand the seller correctly, he's talking about the driveshaft input to the front differential. (See diagram item #5)

I'd guess the front axle is slightly stronger than the 1510D....but I'm guessing:wink: - One thing for sure though, I've never read anything negative concerning the 186D and I have piles of notes that would indicate models to stay away from.

As YOU've often stated, keeping a little reserve cash for incidentals is always a good idea should something pop up that isn't disclosed....But for a 4WD tractor that's $4K under market value, How can you loose OK, don't answer that!!?

Good luck and keep us updated.

Mark
 

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California

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Well, I did it.

I'll go up to Susanville Monday to verify it's as described, and pay. Then next Saturday the seller will truck it down the mountain to Dave's Tractors (a former Yanmar importer, now Mahindra distributor, and an occasional visitor here!) for a lookover and possibly minor repairs. I'll pick it up from Dave's, probably a couple of weeks from now.

When I arranged this with Dave he mentioned he was familiar with the tractor and it is solid, but he couldn't negotiate a price that gave him a margin for cleaning it up into something he could proudly retail. I don't mind dings, I'm buying it to slide under orchard trees that will scratch it up more. Maybe I'll refurbish it by brushing on a couple of coats of Original Rustoleum. (Just kidding Mark! Don't have a heart attack!) Actually I think I'll start reading Mark's Pro Painting thread again. This little rig is small enough to attempt myself.

New toys! I can't wait to get it home.
 

Mark777

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Well...congratulations maybe (LOL)!

Dave? Is this the great dealer from Red Bluff? If so I really miss all the great information and help he used to give in the Yanmar forums. Great guy and very Yanmar smart.

BTW, Whiskey painted that tractor in a chicken coop (YM187) and it was his very first attempt at painting anything before. We exchanged hundreds of emails and phone calls on prep, chemistry, safety and problem solving/trouble shooting. A man who would not give in and did a very nice job. It's not often a person will dive in and learn how a spray gun works but he did.

Look forward to hearing about the new little brother to your YM240.

Mark
 

California

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Boat load of difference in how smooth the three cylinders are.

I've never read anything negative concerning the 186D and I have piles of notes that would indicate models to stay away from.

As YOU've often stated, keeping a little reserve cash for incidentals is always a good idea should something pop up that isn't disclosed....But for a 4WD tractor that's $4K under market value, How can you lose
The good: I like the smoothness, it runs like a sewing machine. And that magic automatic transmission is as nice as I had hoped. New battery, new seat, all good tires, I think new hoses, and $175 of filters and manuals. He threw in a back blade and a 250 lb steel plate I may make wheel weights from. The 3 digit hour meter shows 980 which means little. It's a high serial number so maybe 1985???

All for $2500, while on Craigslist right now there are two other examples of this model, nicely repainted, that are priced $6500 and $6750 (and none with loaders). More realistic are examples with loaders I see occasionally, in good condition, under $5k. And a lot cheaper for ones that are 2,000 miles from here.

However: I budgeted $500 for Dave (yes that Dave) to go through it and fix anything major since I don't have any free time right now. He did a better job of checking it out than I did. First thing he did was fill the front axle up to spec - and the oil gushed out everywhere. $450 estimate to re-seal the front axle's hubs and input shaft plus several other minor issues, for example a stuck brake that I was going to do myself.

It sure looks like the seller kept the front axle fluid low intentionally, because the tractor was immaculately clean when I looked it over.

Well...congratulations maybe (LOL)!

Dave? Is this the great dealer from Red Bluff? If so I really miss all the great information and help he used to give in the Yanmar forums. Great guy and very Yanmar smart.
Dave (Dave's Tractors in Red Bluff [far northern California]) is great! He has moved up from importing clean Yanmars to becoming the Western region Mahindra distributor. He's proud that his business has held up pretty well during this recession, and Mahindra is gaining market share. (I still intend to buy stock in Mahindra. Now I wish I had before the stock price doubled recently!) He's too busy to start on my rig for a day or so.

I sure hope he has found everything so I never have to look under the hood for a few years. Hopefully this YM186D will be as troublefree as the YM240 I've had for five years. It has needed only one 75 cent part in that time, beyond normal maintenance.

Mark, do you have any suggestions for lowering the seat? There is 4 inches of air under it but the seat supports are also the fender braces so I can't just cut them down. I'm buying this to go under trees in the orchard, so it would be ideal if I could duck down to leave the steering wheel as the highest point. Also, can the wheels be mounted on either side of the flange? It looks to me that there is a shoulder to center the wheel only on the side of the flange that has the adjustable-width bolts. Is it ok to mount the wheels outboard of that flange for maximum width? My tractor already has the flanges opposite of what shows in Whiskey's picture, above; my adjustment bolts are inboard of the wheels.
 
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Doc

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Congrats Chris, sounds like a steal at that price. :eek:
Smart move to have Dave go over it before you take her home. I bet you do get years of good service from it before having to do any repairs at all.
 

Mark777

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Yes, you can modify the seat, lower the seat frame platform and reposition the fender stablizers. The only consideration while fabricating the seat height adjustment is raising the rock shaft arms to make sure they don't hit the seat back.

The hexagonal hubs are a seperate component from the wheels and axles. The can be removed and repositioned to the inside/outside of the wheel....as well as the wheels can be reversed and moved from one side to the other. The (two?) set bolts with springs to the hub can also be loosend and reset at different lengths on the axles.

Mark
 

California

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Thanks Mark, and Doc.

It looks like this is going to turn out to be a fairly priced reconditioned-where-needed unit (seals, brakes, etc) rather than a screaming bargain for a ready to use tractor.

So far I don't see anything that would carry the total cost above what it's worth. Keeping my fingers crossed!
 

Tvern13

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California - You lucky dog you! Two Yanmars - took me 15 years to talk the CFO into getting one. I did finally justify it with all the dirt work that had to be done after the construction at my house. The price to hire someone to do the work would have been more than half the cost of the tractor and implements.
 

California

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As I noted above, I had it checked out at Dave's of Red Bluff. Rob there replaced the seals in the front axle plus a couple of other minor things like freeing the stuck brake. Overall it now seems to be ready for another 25 years of troublefree use.

I'm laid up with back problems so I haven't gotten up to Red Bluff to pick it up from Dave's. I'm dying to put it to use. But for the moment, about all I can do is read the Operation and Service manuals.

It checked out excellent on Dave's dynomometer. "The dyno went great, no problems, around 15 to 16 hp at PTO. (Runs strong.)" (from an email today.)
15-16 hp measured at the PTO meets new-tractor specs!
Not bad for 25 years use!!! Maybe the 980 hours showing on the hourmeter, is all it has.

I'm thinking about buying (or making) about 125 -150 lbs of front bumper weights. Dave's has 35 lb suitcase weights at about $1 per lb. (and no shipping cost since I would pick them up there.) Will I find them cheaper anywhere else? I've never seen any on Craigslist etc. Is it reasonable to cut suitcase weights out of 1/2" steel plate? I already have the plate, but no torch.

I will load the rear tires with water which should give about 85 lbs per side. My primary use will be the 4 ft rotary mower, and using rear forks to carry a 4x4 harvest bin as a carryall. Also possibly a 4 ft disc for a few hours/year, or even my 5 ft tiller (RS1400) if this thing can lift it.

How much ballast can I hang on this little tractor before it's too heavy to maneuver? Could it use wheel weights in addition to the filled rear tires? Do these small tractors need both water and iron weights for the back wheels? All four wheels?

I have a lot to learn about thse modern :D tractors.
At the moment I'm full of newbie questions!
 

urednecku

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Cali, good luck with the rest of the projects, but, FIRST, TAKE CARE OF THAT BACK!!! You know how I know.............:hide:
 

Mark777

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"How much ballast can I hang on this little tractor before it's too heavy to maneuver? Could it use wheel weights in addition to the filled rear tires? Do these small tractors need both water and iron weights for the back wheels? All four wheels?"

California,



I'm assuming you are after weight to counter the effects of your uneven and hilly terrain?



This is something I've often thought about, but my property is nearly 'salt flats' flat. I Consider front (bumper) weights to equal to, but no more than, the weight of an appropriate sized FEL and full bucket. About 500-550 lbs (and this is my best guess). The gain in stability and traction is a compromise with control in steering. The additional weight to that sized tractor pretty much negates the use of 2WD.

My only experience that is remotely related was adding front weights to my YM1401D (The tractor did wheelies without any front weight when attached to rear implements.) I used four 5" x 5" x 48" square tubing, filled with rebar and concrete with a combined weight of 400#s. This hung securely from the front bumper to counter balance my RS1100 roto-tiller of approximately the same weight. Horrible idea, as the tractor plowed badly during turns, and strained nearly always unless I selected 4WD. I removed everything forward of the bumper and redesigned shorter filled tubes that weight in at 220#'s, which relieved the poor steering symptoms, and nearly balanced the front to rear perfectly. And I didn't have to continually use 4WD. The smaller Yanmar tractors are notorious for being over powered for such a short wheelbase and run out of traction long before they do torque (power).

IMO, the absolute best conversion without compromise is down sizing the original wheel/tire height. This lowers the center of gravity considerably and provides for a much more stable platform without adding excessive weight. One of the grey market dealers has made, and may offer smaller wheels and tires (turfs and lugs) with the correct rolling circumference for our 4WD Yanmars. Not cheap though...projected prices, including shipping are stated to be around $900. or less if you surrender your old wheels and tires.


P.S. take care of your back!
 

California

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Cali, good luck with the rest of the projects, but, FIRST, TAKE CARE OF THAT BACK!!! You know how I know.............:hide:
Larry, thanks for the encouragement and good advice. Yes, I've been following your thread re your back surgery, and see I posted once. I should have posted more. It's good to see you are back on your tractor!

I started paying special attention to your thread since the second week of July when I went from occasional twinges over a long time, to a severely cramped thigh that still is bruised from so much cramping. I went in then, finally got an MRI, and just today was told it is a 'compressed disc' and pinched nerve, l3-4. (Apparently lower back). The doctor has advised only rest and painkillers, with surgery probably not needed if I avoid further injury. So I'm doing little. On my own I tried crutches and this feels much better when I move around, by avoiding loading the spine. I'm not getting anything accomplished but at least I'm portable.

That's a cute photo
with the kid doing all the work and you just along for the ride!
 
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