Net Tractor Talk
       

Go Back   Net Tractor Talk > Owners & Operators Forums > Gardening, Landscape, & Landcare Forum

Gardening, Landscape, & Landcare Forum Anything about gardening, landscaping or landcare goes here.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 03-09-2011, 12:39 PM
jwstewar's Avatar
jwstewar jwstewar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: South-Central Ohio
Posts: 655
Thanks: 9
Thanked 45 Times in 35 Posts
jwstewar is on a distinguished road
Default Bit of a neighbor problem

We are having a bit of a problem. We have a creek/ditch that runs through the property. When we bought the property the realtor (and owner) told us the ditch only has water in it when it rains. After almost 12 years and 2 droughts, I have yet to see it dry. So I say it is a creek (it has minnows in it the summer) and not a ditch. Any way....

This creek comes down from the hills, runs through the neighbor's property before it comes to ours (his property is behind ours). We are having the opposite problem that most creek owners do. It isn't stealing our land it keeps bring us more. We have to clean it out quite a bit because it will fill up with sand/gravel/silt. I've had people in 3 times to do our section and try to keep up with it with the loader on the tractor for what I can. The neighbor has always been good about keeping their section cleaned out too - at least until the last year or so. There is probably a 250 - 300' section that is completely filled with sand/dirt/trees to the point that the creek is completely clogged. The water is continuing to run except now it is coming out of its banks and running down through our yard. Completely flooding our yard. It is really tearing the ground up and the worst part is, it is running across our leach bed. We have had a continuous supply of water running out of the perimeter drain now for about the last 3 weeks or so and I've never seen water run out of it before. The water is then filling the front road ditch and actually running over the road. Proably 4 - 6" deep.

I haven't had a chance to talk to him yet to see what if any thing he is going to do. Just trying to get my game plan together. I have my tractor and he has his 36 HP Long, but neither of us have a hoe. If I did, I would already be out there doing something permission or not. We have had a pretty good relationship so don't want to ruin it but don't want to ruin my leach bed either. With the new laws who knows what type of new system we would have to put it.

Thoughts on how to approach this with the neighbor?
__________________
Jim
http://www.facebook.com/floweringgoatfarm
"What did you break now?"
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 03-09-2011, 01:02 PM
Doc's Avatar
Doc Doc is offline
Chief Bottle Washer / Admin

 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Ohio USA
Posts: 5,859
Thanks: 1,836
Thanked 440 Times in 276 Posts
Doc is on a distinguished road
Default

Tough one. No suggestions on the neighbor but I had a friend in Cols who had 7 acres and a creek through it. The creek did like yours, filled up and actually changed course. When the regulatory commission in charge of such stuff noticed the path of the creek had changed they fined them and had them pay 7k to have the creek routed as it originally was. Seemed crazy to me at the time but that is what they did. That as back in 95 or so. Walnut creek on the east side of Cols.
__________________
Scott me up Beamy!

Other Fun Forums:
Forums Forums .com +++ Net Pet Talk Forums +++ Net Cooking Talk Forums +++
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-09-2011, 01:20 PM
jwstewar's Avatar
jwstewar jwstewar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: South-Central Ohio
Posts: 655
Thanks: 9
Thanked 45 Times in 35 Posts
jwstewar is on a distinguished road
Default

When we bought our property I know one of the provisions in the deed said that we are not allowed to alter the course of it any way. I'm sure their deed had the same thing as they bought one parcel of their property right before we did and one right after all from the same realtor/owner that we did. So I'm not sure what the ramifications of it changing course naturally are. I've done a little bit of search on the net and can't find any on requirements to keep ditches/creeks clear other than a few misc. one where within city limits there was a local law. I've tried to involve the township to help keep my section of it clear, but they wouldn't do much because it was private property. I tried to play the card of it'll keep the water off the road, but that didn't help any.
__________________
Jim
http://www.facebook.com/floweringgoatfarm
"What did you break now?"
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-09-2011, 02:19 PM
California's Avatar
California California is offline
Super Moderator

 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Sonoma County (Wine country N of San Francisco)
Posts: 1,371
Thanks: 38
Thanked 140 Times in 93 Posts
California will become famous soon enough
Style: VB_Blue
Default

Sounds like you are at the mercy of a Force Of Nature as far as the legal situation.

I don't see any alternative to working cooperatively with the neighbor to keep the creek in its traditional channel. Would he agree to help build a levee or berm that starts up in his portion and continues down through yours?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-09-2011, 02:42 PM
jwstewar's Avatar
jwstewar jwstewar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: South-Central Ohio
Posts: 655
Thanks: 9
Thanked 45 Times in 35 Posts
jwstewar is on a distinguished road
Default

Here is a couple of shots from overhead of our land. First one is just the over head shot from the Auditor's office in Fall of 2008. Second one has been modified with my great artistic skill.

The small redline represents the area where the creek is supposed to flow. The purple area is where there is a bunch of dirt pile up kind of forming a dam from previous cleanouts. These are steep enough that you won't be able to drive up and down them with the tractor to use the loader to cleanout the creek. The turquoise area where the water is now running/ponding.

A little more info. The first little white building is owned by a different guy. It is the other one's FIL. The FIL used to own this whole section but about 2 years ago he sold/gave it all to his daughter except for the little piece you see outline directly behind our property. But notice now the FIL's property stops just short of the creek. So currently the water is now running across is property as well where before it didn't.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg map of land.jpg (40.5 KB, 254 views)
File Type: jpg map of land 2.jpg (42.4 KB, 253 views)
__________________
Jim
http://www.facebook.com/floweringgoatfarm
"What did you break now?"
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-09-2011, 03:14 PM
California's Avatar
California California is offline
Super Moderator

 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Sonoma County (Wine country N of San Francisco)
Posts: 1,371
Thanks: 38
Thanked 140 Times in 93 Posts
California will become famous soon enough
Style: VB_Blue
Default

Wow. Maybe a north/south levee along your eastern property line?

Is that a retaining wall, or dropoff, separating your neighbor's cultivated land from his flood area?

FIL knew what he was doing when he disposed of the downstream parcel. That whole area looks like a floodplain.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-09-2011, 03:35 PM
jwstewar's Avatar
jwstewar jwstewar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: South-Central Ohio
Posts: 655
Thanks: 9
Thanked 45 Times in 35 Posts
jwstewar is on a distinguished road
Default

Nothing, actually just flat. Just what he hadn't disced up. The FIL's name is Nick but we call him Mental because you never know what he is going to do. When he own that whole other section he went out one November and disced the whole hill side. I asked him then he he was trying to give me the property (not quite that nicely ). Told him I would own it by spring. Sure enough by the time spring came around all of the soil had wash down the hill and clogged my section of the creek up. That was one of the times I had to clean it out. He had some crush asphalt hauled in for his driveway. He had it packed down pretty decent. Next thing I know he is out there running the disc over it. Made a heck of a screeching noise, never did figure out why.

If we could get our tractors over across the now wet area I would think we could move the dirt out of the way that is still piled up from the last time they cleaned it out. We then might be able to get ours (or at least my loader) down into the creek low enough to at least get the water flowing. Not sure if we can do that or not with how the water is now flowing. I don't know if he will be able to help with his tractor or not. There is something weird with the loader on his tractor. It is the factory loader but it barely sits flat on the ground and then to get it to go down your are at too much of an angle to dig and you more like scrap the ground. My little tractor with a smaller bucket (and HST) will out dig his larger tractor because of bucket design.
__________________
Jim
http://www.facebook.com/floweringgoatfarm
"What did you break now?"
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-09-2011, 06:22 PM
bczoom bczoom is offline
Senior Member

 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,909
Thanks: 182
Thanked 500 Times in 384 Posts
bczoom is just really nicebczoom is just really nicebczoom is just really nicebczoom is just really nice
Default

I read through this and "think" I understand but really not sure. Therefore, take the following with a grain of salt.

I have a creek through my back yard which may be similar to yours, but my topography is hilly so it doesn't get a lot of leeway on where it can go.

First, clean out all the debris. Trees, branches or otherwise that can obstruct the flow. That may take care of 90% of the problem. Not only on your property, but downstream as well. Looking at the maps provided, you go under a culvert. Make sure that's not blocked. BTW, while I'm thinking of it, if that culvert under the road isn't big enough to handle the volume, you need to talk to the town or whomever takes care of it and have them re-size as needed.

In general, it appears to be straight (which is good). Find what is hindering the flow (look several thousand feet in each direction, particularly downstream) and remove the blockage. Water can move quickly and cleanly which it should given how straight yours is. Whatever is causing it to back-up, fix it (be it yours, your neighbors or the government property).
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-09-2011, 07:08 PM
jwstewar's Avatar
jwstewar jwstewar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: South-Central Ohio
Posts: 655
Thanks: 9
Thanked 45 Times in 35 Posts
jwstewar is on a distinguished road
Default

You are on the right on the right track Brian. Problem is the obstruction is on the neighbor's property. It is blocked on his land and rerouting to our land. If he can get it back into the banks we'll be OK.
__________________
Jim
http://www.facebook.com/floweringgoatfarm
"What did you break now?"
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-09-2011, 07:51 PM
bczoom bczoom is offline
Senior Member

 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,909
Thanks: 182
Thanked 500 Times in 384 Posts
bczoom is just really nicebczoom is just really nicebczoom is just really nicebczoom is just really nice
Default

I would think that if his "mess" that's causing the backing up onto your property, you have a legal course (if needed and he's not being "neighborly") to get it corrected.

He can fix it, or together you can fix it.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 03-09-2011, 08:42 PM
jwstewar's Avatar
jwstewar jwstewar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: South-Central Ohio
Posts: 655
Thanks: 9
Thanked 45 Times in 35 Posts
jwstewar is on a distinguished road
Default

That is what I would like to see happen, but so far I haven't seen any movement from him, so hopefully I'll see him tomorrow and see what his plans are and can "push" him to move. I really want to avoid the legal route if at all possible, because that will just make for a bad situation to be living next to.
__________________
Jim
http://www.facebook.com/floweringgoatfarm
"What did you break now?"
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 03-10-2011, 05:53 AM
Doc's Avatar
Doc Doc is offline
Chief Bottle Washer / Admin

 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Ohio USA
Posts: 5,859
Thanks: 1,836
Thanked 440 Times in 276 Posts
Doc is on a distinguished road
Default

Do you think he's simply waiting for the weather to break and the flood waters to go down? We've had a horrible winter for getting anything done with stuff like that.
__________________
Scott me up Beamy!

Other Fun Forums:
Forums Forums .com +++ Net Pet Talk Forums +++ Net Cooking Talk Forums +++
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 03-10-2011, 06:23 AM
jwstewar's Avatar
jwstewar jwstewar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: South-Central Ohio
Posts: 655
Thanks: 9
Thanked 45 Times in 35 Posts
jwstewar is on a distinguished road
Default

Not sure what is going on. He actually knew it was pretty much clogged last summer when we talked but at that point the water was at least staying in it. At that point he probably could've gotten by renting a mini-ex and doing the work in a day. Now with the water running over the land, I don't think one of them will be able to get there. Now I think it is going to have be a pro with a big guy.
__________________
Jim
http://www.facebook.com/floweringgoatfarm
"What did you break now?"
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 04-27-2011, 11:38 AM
jwstewar's Avatar
jwstewar jwstewar is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: South-Central Ohio
Posts: 655
Thanks: 9
Thanked 45 Times in 35 Posts
jwstewar is on a distinguished road
Default

Thought I would post a little follow-up to this. Late March or so, he must have done a little bit of work with his tractor and got the water flowing a different direction. Not in the creek bed, but at least to the other side away from our yard, house, and leech bed.

So we were OK for a few weeks and then it has really started raining and again it came. I was out mud bogging with the tractor trying to keep the grass under a foot tall. He got on his tractor and started working on it again and then he came over to me. He immediately apologized that this is happening. I could tell he really did mean it and is truly upset about it. He got a lot of it cleaned out with the tractor to go back to the other side again. He is still trying to get it back in the banks, but unfortunately there is once section he is having trouble getting to because of the wet areas on both sides. Now that the water is going to the other side, if it ever stops raining he might be able to get to it from the house side.

I also told him that come summer, if it still needs work, we could go in half on a mini-ex and clean both parts out. I would go get it and tow it with my truck. He was still concerned about money (he is an auto body tech, and right now work is slow), but did seem to be in agreement that we could do halves and try to get it cleaned out again.
__________________
Jim
http://www.facebook.com/floweringgoatfarm
"What did you break now?"
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 04-27-2011, 05:18 PM
Cowboy's Avatar
Cowboy Cowboy is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: SC Kansas
Posts: 262
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Cowboy is on a distinguished road
Default

Sounds like perty good news to me . Glad it looks like you can at least work it out together . To bad its right into the rainy season though otherwise you could do dueling tractors and get a handle on it much sooner . Best of luck JW .
__________________
"Whoever said the pen is mightier than the sword obviously never
encountered automatic weapons." - General MacArthur
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-26-2011, 07:49 AM
Tennslim Tennslim is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Western Tenn
Posts: 9
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Tennslim is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

Read thru this set of posts.
Undoubtedly the rain, obstruction and land drainage plus the "neighbor" are real problems.
Water flow, in my area, that obstructs or floods county roads is dealt with by the local COuty judge. He has the Road Scrapers, Dozers and other heavy movers to aid local farmers in directing water flow, so all benefit.
I am building a "beaver" type wet land out of fallen tree debris, rocks, etc that allow the excess water to accumulate prior to entering the roadway. The Road Scraper constructed a path/ditch that runs the excess to a down hill stream bed.
Cooperation at its best.
Semper FI
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:51 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2002 - 2018, www.DotHQ.com